[Oskee] FW: Juice benched

Mon Oct 19 17:13:50 EDT 2009

Something that I'm not sure was answered is whether we had time outs left at the end of the game.  Coach took his headset off with a few plays to go and pretty much let the offensive run out the clock.  The great thing about college football is that strange, great  things tend to happen if you try.  TD -- recover an onside kick, Hail Mary.  Are we so good that this scenario is beneath us? ... "Ok guys, we might as well just give up."  It's like the discussion a few years ago about ND declining a bowl invitation.  Please.

Just curious.

GT

-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Mingee <mingee at swbell.net>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Mon, Oct 19, 2009 1:44 pm
Subject: Re: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

Ouch.  At least it doesn't sound too bad -- I guess we'll have to wait and see if he can go against Purdue.  And I'm relieved to hear that all tests were negative for Hardeman.

I probably paid even less attention than usual during this game because my kids (who ordinarily will not sit down and watch football on TV) decided to watch the game with me, and were laughing at all the things going wrong, and my reaction to them (or lack thereof in most cases).  I didn't know whether to laugh along with Zook or puke when the camera cut to him laughing (but clearly not in humor) at one of the second half turnovers Juice had.  In the immortal words of Clark W Griswold, "Worse?  How can it get any worse?!?  Look around you -- we're at the threshold of hell!"  I think at this point you just have to laugh to keep from screaming...

-- robert

From: Chad Kahl <cmkahl at gmail.com>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Monday, October 19, 2009 11:09:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

Leshoure suffered an ankle injury

http://www.illinihq.com/news/football/2009/10/18/zook_guenther_meet_like_always (bottom of article)

On Mon, Oct 19, 2009 at 11:05 AM, Robert Mingee <mingee at swbell.net> wrote:

Man, I can't tell you how much I wish I could be with you, but I just can't (and I would have said that even if I hadn't read this after Saturday's game).  There just doesn't seem to be any spark on the offensive side of the ball, and the defense gives up too many big plays, for whatever reason.  They make a lot of spectacular individual plays, but they cannot consistently stop anyone.

Leshoure was definitely the lone bright spot for the offense Saturday.  If it hadn't been for him eventually wearing out, I can't understand why they simply didn't keep going to them until Indiana figured out how to stop him, which never seemed to happen.  He just kept making play after play, moving the chains.

-- robert

From: "Hooker, Anthony" <hooker at uillinois.edu>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2009 2:55:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

I just want to see them flying around, having fun and playing hard.  I think we can win 5 more games if we just do that and give the ball to a running back 20+ times a game. Leshoure makes plays every time they give him a chance.    We’ve played the best teams on our schedule (except cincy) so maybe we can put together a little win streak and get to a minor bowl game.  I’m going to keep believing.  

From: oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net] On Behalf Of Todd Sweet
Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2009 2:48 PM
To: 'Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List'
Subject: Re: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

This coaching staff is abysmal.  At the very least, even a bad team should play hard and give 100% effort under a good coach.  This team looks confused and uninspired.  Mark my words, if we lose at Indiana and Purdue to get our 6th loss, I think this team will go downhill rapidly.  I see both of those games as toss ups right now at best.

If Zook has a losing season, he should be fired.  That will be 4 losing seasons in 5 years (with the one looking like a total fluke now).  At the very least we should be showing improvement but look nearly as bad as when Zook got here (except we’re faster).  Unfortunately, I think 4 wins will be enough for Zook to keep his job.  Anything less than that will be thin ice.

TS

From: oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net] On Behalf Of Robert Mingee
Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2009 1:22 PM
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List
Subject: Re: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

Oh yeah, I hear you, but other than simply giving up, what can you do?  All of hte timeframes below except for Valek were long enough to allow time for the coach to bring in all their own players and establish their system, and yet they still weren't getting it done.  It's really tough in college where you don't have the mechanisms in place to ensure parity like in the pros (there are scholarship limits, but they're high enough that the top programs still stockpile most of the best players and continue to leave the "have nots" like us out in the cold).

Honestly, I really don't know what the answer is.  I don't expect a conference title and Rose Bowl every year, or even every 3-4 years.  I expect some sort of bowl most years, and expect to seldom finish out of the top half of the conference.  With the recruits Zook has had, we should be there, but we're not.  If he can assemble a staff around himself that can do the above, fantastic.  But if he can't or won't, I don't see any choice but to start over (again).

Sadly, we can't all have Joe Paterno :-).

I appreciate the perspectives from everyone.  I was somewhat glad to hear the O-line has been off this year, because it at least offers some glimmer of hope that the skill players really can be as good as advertised, assuming the O-line can be improved.

-- robert

From: Larry Roller <larrol at hotmail.com>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Monday, October 12, 2009 10:14:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

But we've tried that housecleaning thing before.  Eight times in my tenure starting with Elliott being fired after seven years (and the slush fund) with a winning percentage of .477.  Valek came in for four years and was fired after winning % of .2.  Blackman came in for six years and was fired after a winning % of .439.  Moeller came in and was fired after three years with a winning % of .227.  White came in for eight years and was fired after a winning % of .533 and various run-ins with the NCAA.  Mackovic came in and left after three years and a winning % of .663.  Tepper came in and was fired after six years and a winning % of .446.  Turner came in and was fired after eight years and a winning % of .38.  Zook came in and has a winning % of .358 in his fifth year.  It's a recurring nightmare.  Forty years and eight coaches later and we are no better off.

Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2009 07:45:46 -0700
From: mingee at swbell.net
To: oskee at heins.net
Subject: Re: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

Well, so much for that.  I went against what I said I'd always do this weekend as far as avoiding the score and watching anyway.  We were at Six Flags all day Saturday, and I wouldn't have had time to watch the game yesterday because of other commitments, so I actually followed the score on my phone while we were there, and decided it really wasn't worth staying up late Saturday just to watch us lose again.  Sounds like Eddie was pretty awful -- no idea how much of that was the MSU defense and how much was him.

I'm sure I'll continue to watch when I can, but it's clear there's no more hope to be had for this season.  And honestly, what reason is there to have any optimism at all going into next season?  I said the same thing after last season, when clearly we should have been much better than we were, and as much as I had hoped I was wrong, sadly I was not.  This is not a rhetorical question, I'm really hoping someone has an answer -- short of a major coaching staff overhaul, which seems very unlikely in light of Zook getting extended in the offseason, is there any hope at all we're not in for another humiliating season next year?  Can this train wreck really be fixed without a housecleaning from top to bottom?

Someone in this thread said we're not nearly as bad as we were in the Tepper years, and I agree, but from a purely pragmatic point of view, is it really any better to lose all of your games against even marginally competitive teams by an average margin of say 7-10 points instead of 21-28 points?  They all still count the same in the final record.

-- robert

From: "Arbuckle, Jeanne" <jarbuck at ilstu.edu>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2009 3:32:45 PM
Subject: [Oskee] FW: Juice benched

As opposed to really poor planning for Michigan State – I’m going to the game. I hope Eddie can give the offense an excitement we haven’t seen yet against a decent team.

From: oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net] On Behalf Of Robert Mingee
Sent: Thursday, October 08, 2009 8:55 AM
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched

Well, that was good planning -- you saw the part where they didn't look hopelessly overmatched...

-- robert

From: "Arbuckle, Jeanne" <jarbuck at ilstu.edu>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2009 12:14:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched

For the first time in more than 23 years, I actually planned (and it was my choice) to be somewhere else during the 2nd half. 

From: oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net] On Behalf Of Chad Kahl
Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 9:37 AM
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched

I have chosen to detach myself emotionally from the football team.  I record the game on the DVR and check on the results before hitting play.  No more allowing a poor performance to ruin the rest of my day/weekend/week...

I hate being a fair weather fan, but I can't take it anymore.  I reserve my blind allegiance for the Illini mens basketball team and the St. Louis Cardinals.

Chad

On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 7:32 AM, Arbuckle, Jeanne <jarbuck at ilstu.edu> wrote:

I appreciate the conversation here, as well. If you put it in my mailbox, I will take time to read it, but I don’t have time to go looking for it! 

I, too, am starting to question Zook’s ability as a head coach. I wanted it to work out because on paper, he recruits great players. Better than we’ve ever had before. But now I’m starting to question whether they really are better than we’ve ever had. Maybe we are getting them because they have flaws we don’t realize at the time.

Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. Sign up now.

_______________________________________________
Oskee mailing list
Oskee at heins.net
http://mail.perusion.com/mailman/listinfo/oskee

_______________________________________________
skee mailing list
skee at heins.net
ttp://mail.perusion.com/mailman/listinfo/oskee

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mail.perusion.com/pipermail/oskee/attachments/20091019/e2678f4a/attachment-0001.html 