[Oskee] Juice benched

Thu Oct 8 09:55:01 EDT 2009

Well, that was good planning -- you saw the part where they didn't look hopelessly overmatched...

-- robert

________________________________
From: "Arbuckle, Jeanne" <jarbuck at ilstu.edu>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2009 12:14:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched

For the first time in more than 23 years, I actually planned (and
it was my choice) to be somewhere else during the 2nd half. 

From:oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net] On Behalf Of Chad
Kahl
Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2009 9:37 AM
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched

I have chosen to detach myself
emotionally from the football team.  I record the game on the DVR and
check on the results before hitting play.  No more allowing a poor
performance to ruin the rest of my day/weekend/week...

I hate being a fair weather fan, but I can't take it anymore.  I reserve
my blind allegiance for the Illini mens basketball team and the St. Louis
Cardinals.

Chad
On Wed, Oct 7, 2009 at 7:32 AM, Arbuckle, Jeanne <jarbuck at ilstu.edu> wrote:
I appreciate the conversation
here, as well. If you put it in my mailbox, I will take time to read it, but I
don’t have time to go looking for it! 

I, too, am starting to question
Zook’s ability as a head coach. I wanted it to work out because on paper, he recruits
great players. Better than we’ve ever had before. But now I’m starting to
question whether they really are better than we’ve ever had. Maybe we are
getting them because they have flaws we don’t realize at the time.

From:oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net] On Behalf Of Robert Mingee
Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 1:08 PM
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched

Man, as much as I hate to admit it, I'm
really beginning to wonder if in fact that's not the real problem (that Zook
has no idea what he's doing).  As all Illini fans are painfully aware
after the Turner era, some coaches - no matter how nice they are or how good
they are at strategy or how hard they work - are simply not head coaching
material.  Because of their ability in a particular area, they end up
getting promoted beyond their level of competence (the Peter Principle?). 
I just don't get a sense of confidence when I hear Ron speak.  I feel like
he's just trying things scattershot to see what might work rather than having a
plan.  If the players see that as well, I can't imagine it does much to
inspire confidence in them either.  He's clearly a tireless worker, and
seems to know a lot about defense.  But that doesn't make him a great
leader.

All that said, Todd has made some excellent points about Juice.  Every
game I've watched has been on Tivo, scanning through huddles and commercials,
just trying to watch in whatever time I have, which usually leads to me being
less than observant, so I've missed a lot of that.  Also as much as I hate
it, I'm no longer emotionally invested in this team.  I watch all the
games I can get on TV, which is most all of them thanks to the Big Ten Network,
and probably always will, but I don't find myself cheering the good plays and
bemoaning the bad plays like I do when I watch the Bears.  I just don't
even care enough to analyze what they're doing anymore.  I've become
resigned to the fact that if we're playing a better team, we will lose, and if
we're playing a worse team, we've got a decent but not certain chance to win,
and it just takes all the fun out of it for me.

But yeah, it's great to have some discussion going on here again -- keep it
coming!  I just don't have time to follow high-volume online forums, so
this is my place for talking over the Illini, aside from the very occasional
trip out to join the local Illini club watching a game.

-- robert

________________________________

From:John Livengood <jdlive at yahoo.com>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Monday, October 5, 2009 10:00:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched
Like I said, why not make the change earlier
in that case? Maybe Coach Zook doesn't have any idea what he's doing and is
simply grasping at straws. Certainly he's got to realize he needs to get things
turned around soon or he's going to be feeling the heat with only 1 winning
season at Illinois in 5 years.

Also, I don't think Juice is the reason we rank dead last in the Big Ten in
rush defense, 10th in pass defense, last in total defense and last in scoring
defense.

________________________________

From:Michael Korst <illinir1 at comcast.net>
To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Monday, October 5, 2009 10:48:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched
Perhaps Coach Zook watched the game film and saw
the terrible performance that we all saw live.  In fact, maybe he
watched Juice's game film from his last 5 games.....all losses.

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Livengood" <jdlive at yahoo.com>
To: "Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List" <oskee at heins.net>
Sent: Monday, October 5, 2009 9:30:02 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched

Right, but supposedly Zook left Juice in against PSU so he could "play
through it", i.e. find his game on the field. So he does that, even though
some of it's in garbage time, and NOW you bench him? Doesn't make any sense to
me. If you're going to make that change, should have been done long ago.
________________________________ From: Todd Sweet Sent: Monday, October 5, 2009
9:52:26 PM Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched Well, that’s true, he did have a
few good passes downfield (which I agree is one of his strengths). But without
putting points on the board, those yards are almost as meaningless as the 2 TDs
were at the end of the game. Which brings me to another issue this team clearly
has…and this has nothing to do with Juice. But the stupid penalties are driving
me nuts. And to me, that gets back to the coaching issues. TS ON a
sidenote…it’s nice to see some chatter on the list again!!!!
________________________________ From:oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net]
On Behalf Of John Livengood Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 8:39 PM To: Fighting
Illini Sports Enthusiasts List Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched Actually,
more than half of Juice's yardage came in the first half, and much of that in
the 2nd quarter when they actually had him throwing the ball down field! I
agree his TDs were meaningless, but disagree that he didn't play well. When he
was given opportunities to utilize his abilities, he did well. ________________________________
From:Todd Sweet To: Fighting Illini Sports Enthusiasts List Sent: Monday,
October 5, 2009 9:13:19 PM Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched I agree with you,
JL, that Eddie (like Juice) shows flashes of greatness, and then makes stupid
turnovers. I’m not sure he’s the answer either. What I disagree with is you
comment that Juice had a somewhat good game. Many of his throws were behind the
receivers. And most of his production came in the 4th quarter. If McGee had
come and scored 2 tds late in that game, everyone would have discounted them
saying he got them during trash time. That’s when Juice got his as well. PSU
playing soft to run out the clock and probably with 2nd and 3rd stringers. I do
agree that Juice has had to deal with the toughest part of the schedule. Maybe
it isn’t fair to pull him now. But he doesn’t look like someone ready to
confidently lead this offense at this time, so maybe this will shake things up.
All I know is I’ve watched way too many football debacles since Macovic left
town. It’s embarrassing that a school with some very rich football history
can’t at least muster up a mid level bowl game every couple of years. And let’s
not forget who is responsible for putting this brutal schedule together this
season. Cincy may turn out to be the best team we play all year. TS
________________________________ From:oskee-bounces at heins.net [mailto:oskee-bounces at heins.net]
On Behalf Of John Livengood Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 7:59 PM To: Fighting
Illini Sports Enthusiasts List Subject: Re: [Oskee] Juice benched Also meant to
add, I think the real problem has been not using Juice's strengths, which are
running the option and throwing more down field. I realize teams are taking
away the long passes by sitting back in deep zones, but the option's been
working yet we don't run it much. Run that until they stop it, then see if the
safeties might be vulnerable to some passes. But to keep trying to make Juice
into a ball control, short passing QB wasn't going to work out.
________________________________ From:Robert Mingee To: oskee at heins.net Sent: Monday,
October 5, 2009 5:31:10 PM Subject: [Oskee] Juice benched I'm sure you've all
seen the story by now that Juice has been benched (though curiously it is not
reported on fightingillini.com).
Opinions? Personally, I don't see how you can possibly pin the losses on him
entirely, but as the team leader, he's ultimately responsible, and I can't
really blame Zook for wanting to shake things up. As with last year,
consistency continues to be his biggest problem -- he's either really on or
really off. I was really shocked to read how bad his stats are, though -- it
didn't seem that bad from watching. >From a purely pragmatic perspective,
this season is over before it even really started -- I don't see any way for
this team to make a bowl. Yes, they have faced tough competition, but it's not
really going to get much easier, and I just don't see any spark on this team.
It's like they're going through the motions. There just doesn't seem to be any
hope of them beating a team that's better than they are, because they are so
lacking in intangibles. The defense can be exciting at times, but it's so
inexperienced. And the offense continues to be so much less than the sum of its
parts, for whatever reason. So I guess there's really nothing much to lose,
except further demoralizing Juice, which really is regrettable. He seems like a
decent kid, and he's done some amazing work in his career, but he's just not
getting it done. If there's any hope for next year, it's getting Eddie some solid
experience in this offense. Sigh. When does basketball season start again? --
robert 
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